Hole in the Rock Road to be paved?

[powderglut]

I saw this on another site and thought it was worthy of discussion. I know we got the Bejesus shaken out of us when we drove the brutal washboard a couple days this spring, (shook my oil cooler line off) and then they regraded and it was sweet. The question is.. will it be less costly over the years if it's paved and will that mean hundreds more vehicles using who wouldn't. The counties now take care of it and seem to get out there whenever it gets super gnarly. That is county cost. The federal gov would likely subsidize this project. ( from a good source). Will it completely ruin the serenity you get way out there? Or.. will it get a bunch of folks seeing just what is right on the road and not exploring.. I still don't know how I feel yet. I'd just soon not see hundreds of more folks out there, but who would they be???
Lot's of Questions.
http://www.americancanyoneers.org/gs...e-study-hitrr/

 

[Nick]

I am against paving Hole in the Rock. Here's why...

- It dead ends
- The scenery along the road is not what average people would get all that stoked about. You still have to get off the road and walk to get into most of the 'goods'
- I think pavement will massively increase the traffic on the sensitive ecosystems within those canyons. Worse than cows... probably not. But still.

As for whether it's more cost effective, I don't have any idea. I love having places where just driving to them is an adventure though. That road is waaaaay better than when I first started heading down it years ago. When I hear people say it's in bad shape, I kind of laugh thinking about what it used to be like. I say let it go to hell - grade it once a year at most and let the adventure live!

 

[Bill]

I hardly call driving down washboards beating the hell out of my car an adventure.

I would be for it only because I would like to save a few bucks by driving my Camry down to a few of the backpacking trail heads.
30mpg is awful nice.

 

[gnwatts]

I have been down that road many times, in various conditions. What a travesty it would be to pave it.
Leave it alone.

 

[Bill]

So why is this a Travesty unless left alone? Still lots of questions to be answered before anyone should make a strong opinion but if its as simple as making the road more durable and cost effective to maintain like the goblin valley road I see no travesty. What WOULD be a travesty is restricted camping areas and campgrounds along the road. This alone with influence my opinion more than anything else.

The scenery along the road is not what average people would get all that stoked about. You still have to get off the road and walk to get into most of the 'goods'

Nicks point actually helped create my opinion. People will still need to get off their asses to see anything worth while so aside from devils garden, dance hall rock, and the hole in the rock what would really be affected by the Cadillac traffic?

 

[BJett]

Yep, it would be an absolute travesty to pave that road. There are enough paved roads, lets leave a little adventure. Of course our fast food society is all about "me, now", so I wouldn't be surprised if it got paved. I enjoy the slow pace, but I'm never in a big rush when I'm in the canyon country. Its a place that just screams "slow down, enjoy".

 

[gnwatts]

Bill

More cars = more people = more restrictions on those campsites you like.

 

[Bill]

I agree.

The human population continues to grow = guide books are created and sold = people see inspiring photos and videos = more and more websites share information to help people find new places to explore = more people = more restrictions as well.

There are a few certain things my book aside from Death and Taxes...

You will find someone lingering under Delicate Arch.
You will see other people when hiking The Narrows.
You will see plenty of people in Coyote Gulch (unless its cold.)
The list goes on..... in fact it could make a nice thread.

Those people you mentioned are already here and more are coming regardless. We have been living the travesty for awhile now.... sucks.

 

[IntrepidXJ]

My suggestion is to stop maintaining the road...that will keep the low clearance vehicles away

 

[Nick]

My suggestion is to stop maintaining the road...that will keep the low clearance vehicles away

YESSSSSSSS!!!!

 

[powderglut]

Obviously the county (Garfield) has now taken over maintaining the road. Nick is right, the road has never been better. Especially compared to the way it was years ago. Getting out to the end was a real adventure back in the day. With the recent road improvements, not too big a deal. (that is... unless.. The brutal washboard) OK guys, regrade it again. I hear they get out there a fair amount.
So....I don't know if they are trying to weigh the costs of maintaining the gravel road or.. having the feds throw in their dollars to help pay for the paving. The fact is, this is a dead end road. It really doesn't pack much of a visual punch to the people driving out to the end and back. As most of us know, you have to get out of your car to see the really good stuff. Paving would likely increase traffic of both types. Also, There will more than likely, be more folks getting access, to the more remote drainages near the end of the road. Those are the one's we prize because they are a bit of a bitch to get out to. As much as I'd like to drive this road with nice new blacktop, my selfish desire to keep these places to the few who make the effort, overrides my driving comfort. ( My wife says "pave it!") Sheesh, maybe next, they'll pave the road out to the Maze. Sweet!!!

 

[slc_dan]

No please.

 

[Cool Danish]

My suggestion is to stop maintaining the road...that will keep the low clearance vehicles away

Ditto!

 

[uintafly]

While the thought of driving down a nice road is nice, I worry about what other restrictions will surely follow. One of the best things about HitRR in my opinion, is that I can get off work at 5 of a Friday afternoon, and have no worries at all about finding a decent place to set up camp (for free) before starting a hike in the morning. Nicer road = more people = more damage = more restrictions and fees.

One of the beautiful things about Escalante is that once you drop into a canyon there is a good chance to go a few days and see no one else. Solitude is becoming harder and harder to come by these days. Keep it difficult to get out there I say.

 

[moose droppings]

thought #1:
highly unlikely.* empty threats from bitter anti-GSENM locals.

the costs associated with such an undertaking (EIS, design, abandonment/re-alignment, rock work, infustructure install [bridges and such], O&M, etc) for a 60-mile dead-end would not be economically feasible with local and state funding. any federal funding for this would be pork-barrelling on par with the infamous Bridge to Nowhere - Alaska (Stevens-R) fiasco that even had died-in-the-wool repubs in heavy opposition. good luck with that. costs would out-way any benefits.

*Speaking as civil engineer here, who for the last 10-years, have writtten numerous feasibility studies, system evaluations, life cycle cost analyses, etc for public utilities/infastructures.

thought 2#:
garfield and kane county were stripped of there potential economic opporitunity in natural resource extraction with the formation of GSENM. the pro-GSENM crowd, wanted/wants them to understand and embrace tourism as a viable economic source as opposed to natural resource extraction and unsustainable ranching. the garfield locals are now beginning to understand the concept and want to exploit tourism with the proposition of paving of the HITRR. they see this as an economic boon. which could very well be.

so, what exactly would you have the locals do for sustenance-sake, other than just go away?

thought #3
better yet. adopt a transit plan like unto Zion National PArk. leave the road as is. keep maintance current. open the road to traffic during off season. close the road during peak seasons. buy a fleet of Unimog people-movers like unto the those employed up on the Columbia Icefields to run visitors up and down the HITRR. a bit shorter in length of course.

a possible win-win for garfield/kane economics and GSENM wilderness?

 

[Bob Palin]

Surely they don't plan on paving all of it? That would be ridiculous, but I can see paving it as far as the Peekaboo & Spooky turnoff. It probably would bring more people and that would probably lead to more restrictions which would be a shame, but I always struggle with what I perceive to be a slightly elitist attitude in keeping popular places hard to get to. I don't want to invade true wilderness or even rough back country, but that road has already opened up the area so much.

 

[Mike]

Less pavement is generally better.

 

[Aldaron]

buy a fleet of Unimog people-movers like unto the those employed up on the Columbia Icefields

Oh, great. Here I am finalizing my Banff/Jasper trip plans tonight to start making reservations tomorrow and you have to go and mention something I had never even heard of...thanks, just thanks!

 

[powderglut]

There had been a few people, a bit upset about these guys jumping in and taking a one sided approach to this issue. I think this is a decent explanation for their stand.

Hole in the Rock Road Position Statement • June 26, 2013​

American Canyoneers’ Board of Directors has heard from some members regarding our recent post encouraging members to participate in the BLM sponsored Hole in the Rock Road (HITRR) focus groups. While most comments were highly positive and supportive of the post, some questioned our call to action regarding paving HITRR. The American Canyoneers Board of Directors recognizes and respects its membership’s need for effective communication and accordingly, we would like to clarify the intent of our post.
In March of this year, off-the-record comments made by Garfield County officials about paving HITRR were first brought to our attention. Earlier this month however, county officials publicly declared their right – and intention – to pave HITRR. Recognizing that the county might take action to pave the road prior to any dialogue or input from the canyoneering community and other outdoor recreational groups, AC made a strong and immediate call to action. Our request to the community to weigh in with their opinion and to participate in the BLM’s baseline study was intended to provide that missing dialogue and most importantly, to put the brakes on any momentum the county had already built to start paving. This was the intent of our post – to tell the county to stop any plans currently underway to pave the road.
We want to be part of the discussion. We refuse to sit back and let Garfield County blithely pave HITRR without regard to other voices. We refuse to allow the county to pave yet another road without dialogue or research, or allow them to ignore yet another agreement not to pave and then just go ahead and do it – as they did with the Burr Trail. We have learned from Garfield County history – and we are determined to not let the county repeat it.
Our call to action was aggressive and, we admit, not especially elegant in wording or tone. We did not mean to offend the sensibility of any readers and, if we did, we hope you will understand and appreciate the urgency and importance of our mission.
Respectfully,
The American Canyoneers Board of Directors

 

[TannerT]

Yep. Don't pave it! I like my roads more "au naturale." Especially for the delicate environs.