Packrafts. The thread.

[Kullaberg63]

I know some of us already own and use these fickle contraptions, whether for remote whitewater runs or simply crossing a body of water on a long wilderness journey.

Yesterday morning at the put in on the San Rafael there were 7 (seven!!) Alpackas being launched within 20 minutes. These things might soon go from fringe to mainstream, like fatbikes and basejumping has.

Before that happens let us become well informed enthusiasts!


image by kullaberg631, on Flickr

 

[Kullaberg63]

The higher end versions of the lightweight, whitewater capable small rafts are becoming more and more sophisticated. Rigid tube supported decks, heavy duty thigh straps, fully supported seats, internal storage. Along with this the weight and bulk goes up, almost to the point where they are no longer PACK-rafts. The one in the foreground on the pic in the opening post is maybe 10 lbs, which is double the basic model.

Are these just an evolution of roadside kayaking? Something new to play with for seasoned boaters? Do such rigs need to be renamed, to avoid confusing nomenclature?

Carrying my boat, together with overnight gear, food, safety equipment, etc, on multiday adventures is an arduous task. Not something I do every weekend. In the long run I will probably be using my boat far more frequently on friendly vehicle assisted day runs. Am I still a packrafter?

 

[BJett]

You're a paddler. Vessel of choice/what its called is irrelevant in my opinion! If I paddle my whitewater kayak on a flatwater lake am I still a whitewater kayaker? Yes, but not on that day... I'm just floatin'.
I do hope you take more epic packraft trips though, for purely selfish reasons...I live vicariously through the trip reports

 

[Dave]

Interesting discussion I'd assume for many of us sitting on the fence. My biggest hesitation in going all-In on a packraft revolves around not being able to actually execute the kind of trips I envision.

 

[Kullaberg63]

Here's some general ramblings of our experiences with Alpackas after 3 multi day trips and numerous day excursions. My wife and son have Yak's, I have a Llama. We didn't order spraydecks, just the plain boat.

Models. Too many it seems. If one is rafting any moving water the specific whitewater models are a must. For solely doing lakes and calm coastline adventures the rest may apply.

Weight. The Alpacka company are giving us the true weight, plus/minus an ounce, of these things. No nonsense.
Going backcountry multiday, and suddenly adding the weight of boat/paddle/PFD/accessories to the backpack, is certainly noticeable. But for us the scope and variety it adds to the trips is totally worth it. It should be mentioned that we live in Moab, and most outings so far has involved the Green, San Juan and Colorado and their smaller tributaries. Premium packrafting adventure territory if access to remote, hard to reach areas is your focus.

Size matters. To work right in tumultuous water the paddler needs to be literally wedged in there. My wife is 5'8", which must be the perfect target size for a medium, or Yak as they are called. I'm 6'2" and a little loose fitting in the large (Llama). On the other hand a medium is too tight, especially if a spraydeck is installed. Wearing or not wearing shoes, and the type of shoes worn, can be used to adjust the fit.

Spraydecks. This is a pretty big question, and off course very dependent on use. Alpacka offers two types: cruiser and whitewater. The cruiser, at first glance, seems the most all round. It can be removed, is much lighter and easiest to get in and out of. But reports from friends are less than glowing. Water pools readily around the skirt, especially at the back, and start leaking. The velcro shifts disturbingly in whitewater, and, as we all know wears out with repeated use. One side of the velcro is semi permanently glued to the boat.
The whitewater deck does not use velcro, but requires part of the deck to be permanently affixed to the boat, adding weight on trips not needing decks. The hefty rigid tubular rim can be removed, though. This deck is a must, clearly, if the focus is on remote difficult runs, but for general adventuring might be overkill.
My kid built a Tyvek/silnylon deck for under twenty bucks. The first iteration failed: Tyvek is too weak, although taping it on with Tyvek brand tape was a success.
My take on decks is either no deck or the whitewater one. The cruiser deck needs improvements before I would consider it. So far I've been happy with no deck, doing up to class II. Some bailing needed!

Alpacka quality and sturdiness. Beyond reproach. It would take utter stupidity to ruin one of these. They can get holed, but field repair is possible.

 

[steve]

what's your take on the cargo fly?

 

[Kullaberg63]

An awesome idea! Essential for multiday technical whitewater. Adds 20oz to the boat. Expensive.

As I mentioned, for us keeping the weight down is first priority. Our trips are mostly land based (boat on our backs), but the river/coast aspects typically are long enough to rule out the Supai or Klymit pool toys.

 

[Kullaberg63]

Currently testing our packrafts on coastal 'treks' in the Pacific Northwest, and finding that they track well and can be propelled sustainably at 2.5/3 knots not accounting for wind and currents. Here's an artsy shot:


image by kullaberg631, on Flickr

 

[steve]

i tried Mike K's packraft this past weekend and it was a night and day difference from my inflatable kayaks. It was quite fun. I see an alpacka in my future.

 

[DrNed]

i tried Mike K's packraft this past weekend and it was a night and day difference from my inflatable kayaks.

How was it different from your inflatable kayak?

I was all in to get an Alpacka this summer ... Then I talked myself out of it - asking myself if this was really what I wanted to get in to? Was the cost / benefit worth it? I envision doing mostly land based trips, with the boat on my back, with the ability to get out on mountain lakes and down rivers.

 

[steve]

I've only spent 10 min in the alpacka on the Provo river, so I'm still a big noob. Here are my impressions right off the bat:

The alpacka feels incredibly light, like it was inflated with helium. It felt like there was no drag. It was so light that a strong paddle was extremely efficient. It felt like I was 10x as strong as I really am.

It was tricky to get it moving forward. It just wanted to wag back and forth. The first few strokes don't seem to propel it forward much. It felt a lot like walking on ice, how the first few steps just kind of spin out then you generate some momentum and you can get moving. After a few strokes it started to pick up momentum and I was able to get moving. However, once you got moving, you could pivot it, but it wanted to continue in the direction it was moving prior to the turn. In other words, you could pivot the nose of the boat wherever you wanted, but it kind of kept drifting on the line it had before. It was a lot like a 2wd rear wheel drive vehicle on an ice rink. This effect lessened the more I paddled, and I'm betting it can be mitigated with proper technique (which I don't have yet).

It wasn't very affected by rapids, which was cool. It was very warm with the spray skirt. The inflatable seat was actually really comfy even though it looks pretty minimalist. Expect to empty the alpacka after every rapids section where it gets filled with water, there's obviously no drain valve. Stability was awesome. It'd take a real dufus to flip it on flat water, but I could see how currents would get it to flip in the wrong situation.

Those are my initial thoughts. I'm sure a lot of this could be reconciled with proper technique, but there's no doubt the craft handles differently. Seeing Mike K paddle it around like it was an extension of his body was cool. He could get moving super fast on it, and he had great control. The light feeling was addictive. I know it defeats the purpose of a pack raft, but if they could add a little skeg to the back, it would paddle a lot straighter.

The material was very durable, but obviously not as thick and beefy as something you'd find in a 20-40lb IK. The light weight and responsive feel are addictive.

 

[DrNed]

@sixstringsteve thanks! Just what I wanted to know!

 

[Mike K]

I have the Yukon Yak (2012) with the cruiser spray deck and a Splat carbon fiber 4-piece paddle.

Some of my thoughts to add to what @Kullaberg63 and @sixstringsteve said:

Weight - I agree, they are awesomely light but the weight quickly adds up if you're actually packing in somewhere and include the PFD, paddle, dry bags, etc. But it's still totally packable and doable for actual packrafting trips.

Size - I'm 5'8" at fit well in the Yak. My buddy is 6'1" or 6'2" and he like the Yak as well for himself. I have another friend who likes the Llama for himself and he's around 6'0".

Spraydeck - The cruiser spraydeck is ok. You still have to dump the boat out since water still gets in during rapids/waves. But I dump a lot less often than my non-spraydeck fiends. So that's a slight advantage. Other advantages are that it keeps the sun off of your legs when paddling long miles. Also, it keeps you warmer and drier on rainy or cooler days. One of the disadvantages is that you have to unvelcro and velcro every time you get in and out. So, most of the time I'm happy I have it, other times it's a minor annoyance. Sort of a personal preference I guess.

Seat - My butt gets sore on longer trips. One of my friends in on his 3rd seat. Not sure how he manages to mess 'em up. =) Maybe it's because he weighs more and the seams give out. I'm a light weight...so maybe that's why it's a non issue for me.

New 2014 model? - Seems like I heard about them making the new model a few inches longer in back to give you more stability and make it less likely to "wheely" back in a hole. My friend took a not-so-fun swim in a class III rapid because he "wheelied" back into a hole. I always lean forward and paddle like heck if I feel like I might get pulled back in a hole/rapid. =)

Manueverability - like Steve said, it's a bit squirrely cause it's so light. The nose moves from 11 o'clock to 1 o'clock as you paddle (if that makes sense). This nose movement goes down drastically on an actual trip when you have some weight up front (your dry bag with your tent and gear). Either way, the packrafts are great for making quick moves, avoiding rocks/obstacles, and setting up your lines for bigger rapids. And if you hit the rapids straight, you're usually fine. Get sideways on a rock or a big wave? You're likely to swim. =)

 

[Dave]

Totally different league from the Alpacas, but I noticed Overstock has a stupid low price ($165) on the already-cheap Klymit inflatable. Calling it a packraft would be generous, but for the hiker just needing to cross a lake it could fit the bill.

http://www.overstock.com/Sports-Toy...hy-Pack-Raft/8329550/product.html?searchidx=4

I hadn't heard of this boat before so I googled around a bit and saw some interesting reviews like this: http://gearjunkie.com/klymit-lwd-packraft

 

[steve]

I've got one at my house. You're welcome to take it for a spin sometime if you'd like. I plan on taking it down the provo river to get a feel for it.

 

[Kullaberg63]

Another saltwater paddle in the bag. 3 days in and around Nootka Sound, British Columbia.

image by kullaberg631, on Flickr


image by kullaberg631, on Flickr


image by kullaberg631, on Flickr


image by kullaberg631, on Flickr

 

[Kullaberg63]

Some thoughts about using packrafts on coastal adventures, in place of seakayaks. The comments are based on Pacific Northwest conditions, which are all I know about, but I know them well.

A seakayak takes skill and experience to be safe in cold water. If one masters it, the rewards are huge but the road to expert level is long and not for everybody. Many of those serious aspects that makes me treat kayaking like a loaded gun with a hair-trigger are diminished or non existent with a packraft. Capsizing: pretty much won't happen. Buddy assists: a packraft paddles acceptably with two. Surf landings/launches: still techy and white knuckle, but much less so. Wet entry: easy. Rocky, steep-to pocket beaches: bring them on!

Add to this the option for packing up and hiking, and suddenly trip planning takes on a whole other appeal.

The downside is about half the speed (even slower upwind), less arrow straight tracking and a decidedly dorky appearance among diehard kayakers.

This summer we tested our boats in remote areas on the outer coast of Vancouver Island, places where mostly seasoned seakayakers go, and felt very safe and capable. We met the kayaking guide book's daily mileages without straining while easily carrying provisions for extended periods. It was generally thought that the boats handled rougher water in a more confidence inspiring manner than a kayak would with our skill levels. We surfed bigger following seas without fear of broaching, worried less in steep chop and tumultuous tidal currents and maneuvered effectively among rock gardens and confused refracted waves along rocky shores.


image by kullaberg631, on Flickr

 

[Dori Coplien]

I keep thinking of getting one to keep in my car. I'd love to go on a drive, spot a nice place and be able to quickly decide to go kayaking. I have a bad back and paddling is on my "no no" list. Would a standard short paddle rather a kayak paddle work with these? Not sure if I am convincing myself that a canoe paddle would be easier on my back or if they really would but I really want to be able to go back to spending more time on the water.

 

[BJett]

You would NOT want a single-bladed paddle with a packraft.

 

[Dori Coplien]

Shoot but thanks for the input