Southern UT, Late June

I did Hop Valley with @pixie1339, @steve and @Tess in early May, starting at Lee Pass and finishing in Hop Valley. The last two miles were brutal and it was probably only 80 degrees, so not sure I'd want to end there in June.

Oh yeah, Kolob Arch is right by campsite 9, I think. Honestly, I didn't think it was that great, but it's only about a 1/2 mile hike (I believe) off the main trail. I'd do Beartrap Canyon myself.

later: Steve's got a video of the hike somewhere on here.
 
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it's not a very good view of the arch from where the trail ends. i was disappointed there. but my brother and i walked a little closer that the park service recommends you do, and i liked the view of it a lot better. it was nice being able to see the sky through it.

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Laura said:
The last two miles were brutal and it was probably only 80 degrees, so not sure I'd want to end there in June.
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I feel your pain. I did it as an out and back from Lee's Pass in June 2011. That big climb out from Timber Creek to Lee's about did me in. It was probably into the 90's. Not so bad if you take it slow and steady and drink a lot, but I was trying to rush out to meet up with folks. Ugh.

TR:
http://backcountrypost.com/threads/la-verkin-creek-kolob-canyons.221/
 
So Ben and Laura, are you guys saying that you think Kolob Canyon and Arch would be a better option than the West Rim Trail? And am I correct to assume you are referring to the 13 mile Hop Valley/La Verkin Creek/Bear Trap Canyon/Kolob Arch hike that I see in one of my books.

I kind of liked the idea of pairing a top of the rim hike (West Rim trail) with a below the rim hike (Narrows) for more variety. If I replaced the West Rim Trail with this Kolob hike I'd be spending all 4 days Ithat I'll be in Zion below the rim and wouldn't be able to do Angel's Landing.
 
My opinion: West Rim one-way is way cooler than Kolob/La Verkin Creek. I'd do either in June, but the West Rim would probably be more comfortable due to the altitude and it being mostly downhill. But Kolob does have a lot more water...

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my very personal opinion is that i wouldn't do either, the west rim or the kolob hike. for different reasons, the west rim is nice, but it doesn't offer a lot for all the miles it is. if you just want to relax and enjoy the area, and the openness up there it could be great. for as good as the view is, it does not change too much over the length of the trail. the kolob hike i think might be not so pleasant that time of year. the bottom line for me is that i think that there are better day hikes in and around zion than either of those trails. if i was revisiting the park, that's how i would do it. angels landing is amazing for the time that it takes to do it. i would be sure not to let that one get away from you if you're not sure when you might ever come back.

others how ever might have different opinions than me, and if i were you, i would remain open to their advice. it's not like there's a bad trail in zion.

the northgate peaks hike is like 4 miles round trip.
 
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Ben has a good point there. If it were me, my top priorities in Zion that time of year would be to get as wet as possible. That wouldn't involve Angel's unless it was a very early start, but it would definitely involve The Narrows and The Subway. Lower Pine Creek is nice with some great swimming holes and you can walk up to the last rap in the tech section without a permit. If you're even a little into ropes, Keyhole is a blast and super short/easy for a tech canyon. Are you at all interested in hiking with ropes? That opens up some possibilities...

Oh, another good one could be day hiking into Middle Echo (non tech). A bit of a climb but it's a beautiful slot that would feel great in the heat. I'm not sure if you have to have a permit to get into the non-tech part.
 
Hmm sounds like you guys think 2 days on the West Rim wouldn't give me the best bang for the buck. I'll look into replacing it with two day hikes instead (Angels landing and another). I'm hitting the books on that as we speak.

Not really looking to use rope @Nick. Besides having no experience with it (and not knowing anyone who could teach me) my head is already starting to spin a little (the million hike options, permits, air travel logistics, etc) I think learning to rappel and whatnot (and making sure my wife learns too), acquiring, traveling with, and carrying the additional equipment would honestly probably overwhelm me. I've already been neglecting the final planning for an overnight hike I'm going on next weekend, so I think it's best I stick to non-technical hikes.
 
I still think the West Rim is worth the time. The biggest downer about it, in my opinion, is that you don't hike far before you get to the water/campsites, so it's not a good way to kill 2 days if you are trying to pack a lot it. In your situation, I might just prefer to do it as a long day hike, or at least start late on one day. I really, really liked it, but I'm also a huge view junky. I couldn't get enough of it.
 
Nick said:
I might just prefer to do it as a long day hike, or at least start late on one day. I really, really liked it, but I'm also a huge view junky. I couldn't get enough of it.
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A book that I picked up recommends doing the West Rim as a 12.2 mile day hike by ascending from the Grotto and then turning around 1 mile after the trail forks with Telephone Canyon. The author says this about their recommended turnaround point...

"Beyond here the West Rim Trail and Telephone rejoin and the West Rim Trail undulates across Horse Pasture Plateau, which is no more exciting than it's name implies. There's nothing Zionesque about it. Instead invest your time on the parks premiere trails, all of which this book describes."

The 12.2 miles in their recommended route doesn't include the half mile spur to Angels Landing so I guess it would be 13.2 miles if I incorporated it in. Obvious downside would be that I'd be climbing more (although with a lighter pack) and hitting the crowded section twice instead of once.

The book also has a different recommendation about the Narrows and advises against the overnight and doing a 10 mile out and back dayhike turning around at Big Spring.
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Makes sense but again, I'd face the crowded section twice instead of once.

If I did the West Rim and The Narrows as dayhikes instead of overnighters, not only would it free up 2 extra days for other dayhikes (like Observation Point and something else) but I would then be able to bring my heavier 4 person circus tent instead of my backpacking tent and set up shop at a campground where I would be allowed to make a campfire at night (assuming you'd still want a campfire in the heat of June).

I'd be really interested in hearing what you guys think of these recommendations and whether you think going this direction towards doing all day hikes is the better way to go?

Btw - the book that I reference twice here is called "Hiking from Here to Wow - Utah Canyon Country" by Kathy and Craig Copeland.

Sorry for another really looong post.
 
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Better for packing more things into a short time perhaps, but personally, I would never do either hike like that. Out and back up to Cabin Spring/Telephone Canyon would be BRUTAL in late June, IMO. That is a big climb. So much better to cruise down through it with the much shorter climbs mixed in with the downhill route. And I feel I need to defend the part of the trail before you get to Cabin Spring. It might be called Horse Pasture Mesa, but those views are fantastic! Just my personal opinion though. Be sure to check out my TR from it if you haven't: http://backcountrypost.com/threads/the-west-rim-of-zion-national-park.871/

On the Narrows, again, I disagree with the author. Another option for doing it as a day hike is still to do the top-down but not as an overnighter. Depending on your fitness level, that might be really physically demanding. Yeah, only 16 miles, but it feels like 32. With a tiny day pack it might feel a lot better though. But I know a good amount of people do it that way. For me part of the awesomeness is staying in the canyon and having that backpacking experience. Another way to reconcile that with packing a lot in is just getting out quick the first day. The bottom tourist section of the canyon is gorgeous, and the earlier you leave camp, the more of it you'll have to yourself. Once you run into them, you'll probably just want to keep running (like I did). But doing it from the bottom as an out and back is certainly better than nothing, but top-down is king, IMO.

My reports from the narrows:
http://backcountrypost.com/threads/the-zion-narrows.1006/
http://backcountrypost.com/threads/backpacking-the-zion-narrows-angels-landing.556/
 
Given the time frame and the SERIOUSNESS of the seasonal outlook I'd stick to higher elevations to say the least. Zion and Bryce are amazing, but they are forecast to have temps WAY above normal:

http://www.cpc.ncep.noaa.gov/products/predictions/long_range/seasonal.php?lead=4

Also note precip could be well above normal too, with that heat it could mean REALLY violent thunderstorms so I'm not sure about the Subway and other places flash flooding could be a MAJOR concern.

Capitol Reef may be my favorite NP in Utah and it is higher elevation. Will likely still be a serious roaster. Any thoughts of dismissal because the heat will be dry as opposed to the humidity you have in the Mid-Atlantic should be thrown in the trash can of ignorance that has and will kill.

I understand we all have priorities and have to do our best to fit them within the time windows we have but I would be prepared to REALLY be able to punt and head for the Uintas or up to my neighborhood. For that reason I'd think of Canyonlands and Capitol Reef so you could fly into SLC and have the option to go North if the forecast holds true as it likely will. As much as folks love to deride weather forecasters in my experience these seasonal outlooks are accurate far more often than not.

Whatever you do I hope you have an awesome time. I simply encourage you to really think how appropriate your desired destinations are at that time in any year let alone one forecast to be far hotter than the normal hades of heat that part of the world is known for. That's why I don't do Southern Utah between May and latest September. Wishing the forecast does not hold true for you but given the fact it more than likely will Be careful man.
 
If you're going to be heading to the Zion/Bryce/Escalante area, I'd recommend also looking at flights into Saint George (SGU). Airfare tends to be about $150-200 more than to LAS, but I've decided that's well worth it for a more relaxing experience (no neon lights or slot machines!). It cuts about 2 hours each way off the drive time compared to LAS, plus you save another 1-2 hrs between waiting at baggage claim and picking up a rental vehicle.
 
Nick said:
Better for packing more things into a short time perhaps, but personally, I would never do either hike like that...
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Nick said:
On the Narrows, again, I disagree with the author. Another option for doing it as a day hike is still to do the top-down but not as an overnighter...
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Good thing I have this site and not just some books! So you think my first itinerary was better? I'm not opposed to overnighting both but it would be cool to free up one more day for something else like observation point... So just out of curiosity, which of those two would be easier to make into a full top down day hike, remembering that I want to include Angels Landing on the West Rim? I feel like I should return the books and send the $50 I paid for them to you instead lol.

Absarokanaut said:
Given the time frame and the SERIOUSNESS...
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Thanks Absarokanaut. I assure you I'm very diligent with my planning and that includes the safety stuff. Pretty much anywhere, anytime of the year has its safety concerns. Just as I'm taking all the proper hypothermia precautions for my Giant Mtn hike this weekend with a forecast low of -8, educated myself about AMS before coming to the Uintas, and check the summit forecasts obsessively in the Whites, I'll make sure to do my due diligence for this trip as well.
 
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piper01 said:
If you're going to be heading to the Zion/Bryce/Escalante area, I'd recommend also looking at flights into Saint George (SGU). Airfare tends to be about $150-200 more than to LAS, but I've decided that's well worth it for a more relaxing experience (no neon lights or slot machines!). It cuts about 2 hours each way off the drive time compared to LAS, plus you save another 1-2 hrs between waiting at baggage claim and picking up a rental vehicle.
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Thanks will check this out and weigh the costs/benefits.
 
Vegan.Hiker said:
Good thing I have this site and not just some books! So you think my first itinerary was better? I'm not opposed to overnighting both but it would be cool to free up one more day for something else like observation point... So just out of curiosity, which of those two would be easier to make into a full top down day hike, remembering that I want to include Angels Landing on the West Rim? I feel like I should return the books and send the $50 I paid for them to you instead lol.
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West Rim would be way easier as a day hike top-down. It's really easy walking for the most part. A few small climbs but mostly cruising on the benches mixed in with big drops that are cut into the walls. And as a day hike, it makes adding Angel's Landing in even easier with the small packs you'd have on. That would be an awesome, action-packed day and easily doable.

The Narrows is much more strenuous due to all the wading and figuring out routes through all the deep holes and little waterfalls and such. Every step there takes more thought as it's all across wet rocks. The nice thing about backpacking the narrows, is that you hardly have to bring anything that time of year. All you really need is a ground cloth and a pad and maybe some warm clothes. I wouldn't pack a sleeping bag or tent that time of year assuming the forecast looked good. And if the forecast doesn't look good, at least in respect to rain, they won't let you in there anyway.

I don't know how accurate those long-term forecasts are that absarokanut linked to, but in a normal year mid-late June is typically just before the monsoon season starts to fire up and the big t-storms start rumbling in most days, although that varies too.
 
Awesome video @steve. What an awesome looking trip. I see you published this to YouTube in June 2nd. When did you guys do the actual hike?
 
Have so much fun on your trip! I don't have much to add except these few things:

-Highway 12 only runs between Torrey (Capitol Reef) and near Bryce, so it only factors into a trip in that area (I think I was reading that you thought it comes down from SLC, forgive me if I misread that)

-yes to all the hot weather concerns, although I play in southern Utah all year long. But then, I'm long used to it and prepared for it. I think all the water hike suggestions are spot on. Bryce would be the coolest park, temp-wise. Cedar Breaks is a fabulous idea as well. Any of the parks are doable in the summer; you just have to be very aware of your limits, that your body is unused to the elevation and aridity, start as early in the morning as you can and don't move as much during the hottest parts of the day, and remember to not push yourselves too much overall. :)

-I'd second the suggestion to look into flying into St. George if you do plan to mostly hit up Zion & Bryce. I think paying a little more for flying in there ensures less driving time, more relaxing/hiking/enjoying time. The drive from Vegas doesn't become particularly interesting anyway until you hit the Virgin River Gorge

-if you did decide to make it toward the Staircase and hiked Lower Calf Creek, remember that trail is very exposed and can be brutally hot even by early May. Dipping your feet in the freezing cold pool below the falls when you get there, though, is a nice reward for the hike.

-look forward to seeing the pics afterward!
 
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