Wave permits during government shutdown

Spacejumper

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Oct 12, 2013
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3
Hello,

I am new to this forum but I hope that someone that knows the BLM Arizona operations can help me with some information.

Here is the context: on Oct 1st at 8:00AM I received an email from the Paria Coyote Buttes North Permit lottery system that I won two spots for the hike to The Wave in January 2014. Amazing news for me, considering that I was trying to get in there for about five years.

I tried right away to complete the registration process just to find out that all the websites that have anything to do with the BLM and the lottery are closed due to the Government Shutdown. The email I got contains a phone number that unfortunately has no voice mailbox attached to it.

The deadline to reply is October 15th 2013.

At this point I am desperate trying to find a way to confirm that I want the permits. I was trying to get in there for a number of years and, now when it finally happened, I cannot believe that I am unable to finalize a basic registration process. I am sure a lot of people are in my position right now.

I would appreciate if someone could point me in the right direction or at least provide a fax number where I could send a letter explaining why I cannot complete the registration.

IMHO the BLM Arizona should extend the deadline until when the winners should register as these are extraordinary circumstances.

Thanks for your help,
Alex

Moderator note - this was moved from the general gov shutdown thread here: http://backcountrypost.com/forum/threads/government-shutdown.2477/
 

Nick

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Hey Alex,

This is total guessing, but I'd bet that the process will just resume once the shutdown is over. Like I imagine it will open and you'll get another email saying you now have 'X' days to confirm and pay. You're not going to find anyone to help you right now, they're all furloughed. If I were in your shoes I wouldn't worry too much. That email showing you won should be all you need. Just get all over it the day the shutdown ends.

Welcome to BCP!
 

Spacejumper

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Thanks Nick for the quick reply!

In the back of my mind I figured out a while back that pretty much the process will go as you described but, you know how human nature is... it needs re-assurance when certain things are at stake. I know that in the grand scheme of things this is after all just a hike. Not world hunger, not a war... but sometimes we need small goals like this to get us through the daily grind.

One more question: in case you are familiar with the area, what are the chances that coming end-January the dirt road between Highway 89 and the trail head to be impassable?

I know this can happen and I am prepared to risk a trip from Vancouver, BC all the way to northern Arizona but it would be better to have some sort of idea what my realistic chances are.

Thanks again!
 

Nick

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It totally just depends on recent conditions, day time temps, etc. The House Rock Valley Road can get ugly when wet. Melting snow in the afternoon could be a problem. But I know of a lot of people who have done it in snowy conditions. If it is sketchy, going out via the south end in the afternoon would likely have less mud. 4WD would be wise.
 

Spacejumper

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Is there any way to check the condition of the road before hand? I am planning to be in the are a couple of days before the hike date and scout the road conditions but a few things have to line up before I can make that happen.

Given the fact that almost everyone recommends a 4WD in winter time most likely I will be looking to hire a local guide for the day. In the end the goal is to actually make the hike and have some good memories. Getting stuck in the red clay could end up being really expensive, way more expensive than the actual cost of the guide!
 

Nick

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I moved this to it's own thread since it's kind of expanded beyond the shutdown discussion.

The BLM office in Kanab can you give you an idea of road conditions but the most accurate might be through places like this site from people who have been on it recently. The BLM tends to be over-cautious in their advice in that area and for good reason. A lot of inexperienced people tend to head out that way.

No advice on the guide thing.
 

Dave

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One more question: in case you are familiar with the area, what are the chances that coming end-January the dirt road between Highway 89 and the trail head to be impassable?

I know this can happen and I am prepared to risk a trip from Vancouver, BC all the way to northern Arizona but it would be better to have some sort of idea what my realistic chances are.

Can it snow there? Yes. Will it snow there? Possibly. Should you worry about it? Not much.

Even if it snows, it would have to be a pretty good storm to make the road completely impassable. It's not that far a drive to the Wire Pass trailhead.


House Rock Road by ashergrey, on Flickr
 

Laura

freespirittraveler
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Oct 1, 2012
Messages
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Is there any way to check the condition of the road before hand? I am planning to be in the are a couple of days before the hike date and scout the road conditions but a few things have to line up before I can make that happen.

Given the fact that almost everyone recommends a 4WD in winter time most likely I will be looking to hire a local guide for the day. In the end the goal is to actually make the hike and have some good memories. Getting stuck in the red clay could end up being really expensive, way more expensive than the actual cost of the guide!

A good local guide for The Wave is Kurt Robinson. He works for Paria Outpost and Dreamland Safari Tours. Both will charge the same price. I've taken several trips to The Wave with him and he knows all kinds of other unique spots as well. Most people never leave The Wave area but there are all kinds of great things to see out there.
 

Nick

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Can it snow there? Yes. Will it snow there? Possibly. Should you worry about it? Not much.

Even if it snows, it would have to be a pretty good storm to make the road completely impassable. It's not that far a drive to the Wire Pass trailhead.


From what I've heard, it isn't the snow itself that is a huge concern, it's the potential for an afternoon snow melt mud fest if it warms up and gets sunny.
 

Howells Outdoors

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Being from the area, it is the mud that makes these roads impassable.
 

HomerJ

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From what I've heard, it isn't the snow itself that is a huge concern, it's the potential for an afternoon snow melt mud fest if it warms up and gets sunny.

Agree! We woke up to snow on the morning we were to leave. It wasn't that bad, just one spot off of the main road where it sloped towards a water hole, but we made it fine.
 

Yvonne

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worst case just wait until it refreezes again at night.
I went there in 2010 a day after a snow storm with a lot of snow on the roads. It wasn't a problem in the morning but a bit sketchy in late afternoon as mentioned before. We almost had to wait it out but made it.
 

renshiwo

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Mar 20, 2013
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Just my 2 cents... find the fax number for the permit office if you can, and fax a dated reply confirming you want the permits.
 
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