South Coyote Buttes. We are going to put in at Lone Tree Reservoir because we don't have 4wd but we want to make it to White Pocket.

dalekim23

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I need some advise and cannot find a map online of the put in at Lone Tree Reservoir so I can plan out how far we need to hike to get to the White Pocket areas, Cottonwood Cove and South Teepees. Is it possible to do this in one day? What advise do you have? What do we take in (other than photo equip)? How early should we start? Where can I obtain a map? Thank you! Kim
 

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Nick

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This is not at all realistic in a day. It's something like 14 miles of walking in deep, soft sand to get to White Pocket from Lone Tree. ONE WAY. You'll pass by some of CBS but you need a full day just to explore a decent chunk of CBS. Not to mention time to explore at White Pocket.
 

Carcass

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Seriously doubt a day trip. As already stated, lots of soft sand to traverse.(traveling the roads) It's about 2 1/2 miles from lone tree to paw hole. Another 3 to Poverty Flat Ranch. Another 5 miles to road 1086 and then 1/2 mile to WP. If going cross country you will only lessen the distance a bit.

South Tepees are a little over 1 mile from the Cottonwood Cove Trailhead, again over deep sand.
 

regehr

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Maybe rent a jeep? Absolutely do not go to White Pockets with 2wd. (I did this drive last Feb and it was super easy and relaxing driving compared to those bumpy-ass roads in the Swell and Canyonlands. But the sand.)
 

Reef&Ruins

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Maybe rent a jeep? Absolutely do not go to White Pockets with 2wd. (I did this drive last Feb and it was super easy and relaxing driving compared to those bumpy-ass roads in the Swell and Canyonlands. But the sand.)
^^ This!
I have also rented a Jeep from Express Car Rental (I think that is the name) in Kanab and yeah it is pricey but you can get in and out with it. Gas economy will kill you as the Jeep has very large tires but they will also keep you from sinking into the sand. And it is slightly uphill all the way out the standard way (i.e. the way marked on the Trails Illustrated map people like to use).
 

Carcass

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The "long" route is much easier than going through Paw Hole to get to White Pockets. There is a deep sand trap that goes uphill just past Paw Hole. If you dont know how to drive on deep sand, take the long route.

I will be going to Coyote South/Cottonwood Cove next Monday.
 

Nick

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The "long" route is much easier than going through Paw Hole to get to White Pockets. There is a deep sand trap that goes uphill just past Paw Hole. If you dont know how to drive on deep sand, take the long route.

I will be going to Coyote South/Cottonwood Cove next Monday.
x2. I did the Paw Hole road west to east last month after having done it the preferred east to west route years ago. That sand trap just past Paw Hole is formidable. Pedal to the metal and hope you don't find any oncoming traffic! I could see a lot of people getting stuck there. Or just be smart and go the other way.
 

regehr

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x2. I did the Paw Hole road west to east last month after having done it the preferred east to west route years ago. That sand trap just past Paw Hole is formidable. Pedal to the metal and hope you don't find any oncoming traffic! I could see a lot of people getting stuck there. Or just be smart and go the other way.
Damn Nick you're making this sound fun.
 

Titans

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x2. I did the Paw Hole road west to east last month after having done it the preferred east to west route years ago. That sand trap just past Paw Hole is formidable. Pedal to the metal and hope you don't find any oncoming traffic! I could see a lot of people getting stuck there. Or just be smart and go the other way.
Ok- I’m getting a little nervous...wish us luck... we are headed out to Coyote Butte South / Cottonwood Cove tomorrow Wednesday morning early.

Went into the Kanab office today. Supposedly there is also a lot of mud for a few miles on House Rock rd between Wirepass TH and Lonetree (mud is just south of AZ border), so they told us to come in from the south, so we are doing that.
We were already planning on taking the long route to CC. (We will NOT be going eastbound between Pawhole and CC.)
Does the long route also have very deep sand or just normal sandy roads?
(We are in a Jeep- but with little experience in driving in deep sand.)

Does anyone think we need to air down more? @Nick @Reef&Ruins @regehr we are about 32psi early morning when the tires are cold. Do you think we should go lower,?
 
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SteveR

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Based on my two visits to CC- this October in damp sand, in 2015 it was dry and loose, both via the long route- I wouldn't worry about it. You could air down a bit. I was running at 30 cold in our Tacoma loaded with 4WD camper.
 

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Titans

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Based on my two visits to CC- this October in damp sand, in 2015 it was dry and loose, both via the long route- I wouldn't worry about it. You could air down a bit. I was running at 30 cold in our Tacoma loaded with 4WD camper.
Thanks so much Steve, sounds good, will do. We will also leave early and try to reach House Rock Valley Rd when it’s just light. Days are short now. The weather is deteriorating Thursday and Friday again, so we are headed back out the same day. Its been very cool and snowy lately. Hopefully we can get toWhitepocket next week. Thanks
 

Nick

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Yeah, you should be fine. There are some sandy sections on the easier route, but not bad. And with recent moisture, they'll be even easier.
 

regehr

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Does anyone think we need to air down more? @Nick @Reef&Ruins @regehr we are about 32psi early morning when the tires are cold. Do you think we should go lower,?
When I did this (last feb) I didn't bother airing down and had no problems, just put it in 4wd and powered through. The sand was cold and a little damp and that was helpful. Even the good route has plenty of sand so I think this is the time of year to do it.

In fact it was super fun because we were following a couple of land cruisers who were aired down and moving really fast so I just punched it and tagged along and we got there in no time. Without vehicles to follow it would've been slower and not as fun...

White Pocket is SOOO COOOOL you're going to love it. Definitely take a lunch and plan on 4-5 hours there.
 

Nick

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I didn't air down either. In fact, I was aired up for highway travel with the weight of my FWC at close to 50 psi because I forgot. I fixed that the next day...
 

Titans

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When I did this (last feb) I didn't bother airing down and had no problems, just put it in 4wd and powered through. The sand was cold and a little damp and that was helpful. Even the good route has plenty of sand so I think this is the time of year to do it.

In fact it was super fun because we were following a couple of land cruisers who were aired down and moving really fast so I just punched it and tagged along and we got there in no time. Without vehicles to follow it would've been slower and not as fun...

White Pocket is SOOO COOOOL you're going to love it. Definitely take a lunch and plan on 4-5 hours there.
Excellent-thanks, it's so exciting, we have been wanting to do this for a few years now. The word on the street is, that thanks to BCP I finally came to my senses and "let Rick get his Jeep". I have a lot more fun driving in sand than rocky roads with boulders. I drove a lot in Cathedral Valley and quickly figured out it goes best when you keep the speed up! Tomorrow is CBSouth, Cottonwood and Pawhole. We want to also spend a full day at white pocket, hopefully within the next week. @SteveR posted some surreal nice pictures from Whitepocket.
 

Carcass

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Sand is nothing to worry about going the long route to either place. If the sand is wet it will be easy to drive on. Early morning the mud on HRVR hould be frozen , but it is wiser to come up from 89A. Have fun.
 

Cool Danish

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Ok- I’m getting a little nervous...wish us luck... we are headed out to Coyote Butte South / Cottonwood Cove tomorrow Wednesday morning early.

Went into the Kanab office today. Supposedly there is also a lot of mud for a few miles on House Rock rd between Wirepass TH and Lonetree (mud is just south of AZ border), so they told us to come in from the south, so we are doing that.
We were already planning on taking the long route to CC. (We will NOT be going eastbound between Pawhole and CC.)
Does the long route also have very deep sand or just normal sandy roads?
(We are in a Jeep- but with little experience in driving in deep sand.)

Does anyone think we need to air down more? @Nick @Reef&Ruins @regehr we are about 32psi early morning when the tires are cold. Do you think we should go lower,?
Hello fellow Dane :).
I also happen to have a Wrangler and have done both the long route and Paw Hole -> Cottonwood -> White Pocket route several times.
On the long route I have never used 4WD, but aired down more for comfort than traction. As long as you keep the momentum going on the sandy stretches you will have no problems at all.

On the Paw Hole -> Cottonwood -> White Pocket route I air down, 4WD Hi and keep moving without any problems (Summer or Winter). In Winter with a little moisture in the sand this route shouldn't be a problem at all.

On the original 32" Mud-Terrain tires that came on my Rubicon and the new BF Goodrich All-Terrain TO2s I installed, I run 32psi on the highway and air down to 22-24psi for off highway (mostly for comfort :moses:). (The 37psi that is OEM setting, is way to hard for my taste and I have not seen any adverse wear or handling with running 32psi cold on the highway).

You will love everything on the Paria Plateau.. One of my favorite places.. Can't wait to see the TR & pics.
 

Titans

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thanks so much everyone- I really appreciate the help. It went exactly as you all said, no problem. Wow, what a place!

We loved it and it was so much FUN today ! I'm very happy, this was a big boost in confidence with off road driving (so now we will get stuck one day, right). No problems driving, via the long route, to Cottonwood cove (arrived via Jacobs lake into south entry of HRVR!). It was about 20F this morning when we got there, the sandy roads were very firm, frozen. It was just above freezing when we left, roads had loosened up, but no issues. We didn't need to air down further. We were at 29 this morning and 33psi when we arrived at the turn off point at HRVR. @Cool Danish - our Jeep was aired up ridiculous high (40) when we got it. we drove across country with that. Before Cathedral Valley / Capitol reef we took it down to 35, that's much better. Now we drive 33-35, that handles much better on the road and it more comfortable. Our Subaru WRX handles extremely well on the road, so it's been a bit of an adjustment driving the Jeep, especially in high winds. But we couldn't get anywhere on the Paria plateau with the WRX!

I'm glad we had a map and we downloaded the route into Gaia. The roads out there all looked the same to me on the way back : Sand and junipers. I recognized very little on the way back.

Since there was a fair amount of slow walking for 6 miles just looking, taking photos, we were cool all day. Next time we need another layer (@Carcass hint for next week). Normally we hike all day and stay warmer. Anyway... We have no hesitation driving to White Pocket next week, on a dry sunny day. Thanks again.
 

regehr

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awesome!!

yes you'll get stuck at some point -- it'll be a totally easy road with one bit of snow / wet clay / drifting sand and you'll just go for it....
 

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