Government shutdown??

baltocharlie

baltocharlie

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Dec 21, 2012
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What can I expect if they shutdown while I am in S. Utah? Can one still backpack in Canyonlands? Or will they close the parking lots? I figure Arches will be closed...at least the front entrance. Can one come in from another area, camp outside the park then hike into it? Probably frowned upon but would be nice to see Delicate arch w/out lots of others around. Natural bridges?? The key to everything is parking lots. How have they done this in the past?
 
I really don't know. But would expect all "front entrances" like the main gate at Arches to be closed. And ranger stations where one would need to go for backcountry permits to also be closed.

But, I really don't know.

Last time a shutdown loomed, Randy and Jared and I were doing a trip into The Maze that was scheduled to begin the same day as the shutdown (if it happened). I remember watching the news from a motel room in Green River the night before, hoping the infernal idiots that represent us wouldn't eff it up. Anyway, 11th hour deal, no shutdown, yadda-yadda. But when we checked in at the Hans Flat rangers station the next morning, and told them how relieved we were that there had not been a shut down etc., theyacted like they didn't even know what we were talking about? Don't know what the deal was, or would have been, had there been a shut down, but from the way they acted at Hans Flat, I almost think we still would have been able to check in. But, maybe not?

- DAA
 
I think the last time this happened I remember hearing that Escalante BLM people were telling people they would not be allowed to go hike something like Coyote Gulch because the area would be closed. I personally doubt that would actually happen though. Like others said, mostly just the stuff with access gates like National Parks.

I wonder what would happen for some place like Cedar Mesa where you have to get permits though. Either way, there is still SO much to do without that stuff and I'd be beyond shocked if the shutdown were to last that long.
 
Access roads would be gated off for the national parks and monuments, except in the case of roads that can't be closed due to through traffic, private property, etc. BLM lands would likely be accessible, but the BLM contingency plan states that visitors centers and campgrounds would close. That could be problematic because pretty much all of the campgrounds in southern Utah are on NPS or BLM lands. Primitive camping would still be available, but finding a spot could be an issue if that's all that's available. There wouldn't be rangers available to issue permits. I read somewhere online that if you're caught on federal lands in a shutdown you could be charged with trespassing, but I don't know how likely you are to get caught either. They would keep minimal staff working for various purposes, but I doubt they would be patrolling the parks very aggressively to make sure people are staying out.
 
I'm planning on being in Zion and Bryce in 2 1/2 weeks. They are welcome to close the roads but these are public lands so I will just walk to get wherever I want! Shouldn't be too hard in places like Bryce and Zion. If they charge me with trespassing I am going to raise all kinds of public use issues in my case. I'm kinda looking forward to the fight :dance:
 
As for not patrolling, DOI plans state that law enforcement is exempt from the shutdown. You can expect park rangers/LE to aggressively push people out of the parks proper. Park roads that are not thoroughfares will close (but roads like SR 9 would have to remain open).

Don't forget that the Forest Service is under Agriculture, not Interior so you might run into much different restrictions on BLM land versus Forest Service. As stated above, BLM lands should be open but permits will not be available so entering into permit-restricted areas could get you in trouble.
 
Laura said:
They are welcome to close the roads but these are public lands so I will just walk to get wherever I want!
Click to expand...

You just touched on why I can't stand the permit system. imaging hearing me mutter "have to get a permit to go LOOK at the wave" under my breath and with great disdain as I type this.
 
Thanks all.
Is Cedar Mesa permit needed for the Citadel and seven Kivas?

So I can not go to Arches, Needles, maybe Cedar Mesa.
This a big chunk of my trip. I better start routing plan B. Perhaps head toward Escalante or start looking for a lot of dimes.

We'll see what happens, go from there.
 
While Highway 9 will remain open to through traffic, it will be closed to long and wide recreational vehicles due to tunnel restrictions. There will be no recreating in the park, or stopping to take pictures. The Kolob Canyons Road, the Zion Canyon Scenic Drive and Kolob Terrace Road all will be closed.
http://www.sltrib.com/sltrib/politics/56942484-90/canyon-closed-government-national.html.csp

Something is off about closing Kolob Terrace there is soooo much private property up there and hunters up the wazoo right now! Guaranteed someone would break down the gate with some big ole diesel.

I am also planning on Kayaking Black Canyon (below Hoover Dam) I called today and all roads, and the launch site will be closed and patrolled by LE Rangers and like was mentioned guaranteed they will be aggressively enforcing the shutdown.
 
baltocharlie said:
Thanks all.
Is Cedar Mesa permit needed for the Citadel and seven Kivas?

So I can not go to Arches, Needles, maybe Cedar Mesa.
This a big chunk of my trip. I better start routing plan B. Perhaps head toward Escalante or start looking for a lot of dimes.

We'll see what happens, go from there.
Click to expand...

I think if you are day hiking into Road Canyon it is a self service permit at the trailhead. Car camping is not restricted. Actually, you are not accessing Road Canyon to see the Citadel, so maybe a permit is not needed.
Reading up on all of these restrictions now makes me sad.
 
I just heard that the NPS is actually going out and clearing all boats off of Powell today. Doesn't matter if you spent $10k for that houseboat for the week - you're OUT! Sounds like the best time ever to go kayaking there!
 
I hope this shutdown won't lasyt more than few days! I planned days off from work, booked a flight and if they close National Parks for all my trip that is terrible..
 
From the U.S. Forest Service:
Due to the lapse in federal government funding, the U.S. Forest Service is operating with minimal staff to ensure certain essential services. All facilities, including Forest Service offices and developed recreational areas such as campgrounds and picnic areas are closed. General areas of the National Forest where you may drive, hike, hunt and fish remain accessible.

I've heard the BLM opted not to close the gate at Little Sahara because they knew people would just break in. I'm highly interested in hearing from anyone who tries to violate the closure in permit-required areas. I'm wondering how much effort the BLM is putting into patrolling high-interest areas like North Coyote Buttes.
 
ashergrey said:
I'm wondering how much effort the BLM is putting into patrolling high-interest areas like North Coyote Buttes.
Click to expand...

I would just purely guess quite a bit of effort. LEO aren't being furloughed and what else do they have to do? No traffic, no crowds, nothing but likely a clear set of marching orders to enforce the crap out of the closures. Doing so is going to sharpen the pain for users, who might make enough noise about that pain to move their elected representatives to act like adults. It's what I'd do, if I were sitting there with nothing left but cops and wondering how to get my operation back on it's wheels.

Just my guess.

- DAA
 
DAA said:
I would just purely guess quite a bit of effort. LEO aren't being furloughed and what else do they have to do? No traffic, no crowds, nothing but likely a clear set of marching orders to enforce the crap out of the closures. Doing so is going to sharpen the pain for users, who might make enough noise about that pain to move their elected representatives to act like adults. It's what I'd do, if I were sitting there with nothing left but cops and wondering how to get my operation back on it's wheels.

Just my guess.

- DAA
Click to expand...

I don't disagree but just to play devils advocate -- the LEOs have a lot of ground to cover and obviously have to prioritize. They're probably going to patrol trailheads/parking lots aggressively but people finding their way through non-traditional routes could probably get by them.
 
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